More Freeview boxes become obsolete
In May 2008, a bunch of Freeview boxes served by the Sutton Coldfield transmitter stopped working. Now it looks like boxes in Scotland have gone the same way.
Boxes powered by the SetPal technology, including those made by Daewoo, Labgear, Portland and Triax, lack sufficient internal memory to cope with the number of Freeview stations after a transmitter upgrade, and become useless.
More on the story, including a quote from our sister site, Radio & Telly can be found here: Daily Record 5 July 2008
There are believed to be between 200,000 and 350,000 affected boxes in the UK, and as the transmitter networks get upgraded ready for the Switchover, more and more boxes are set to become landfill fodder
I have three of the Daewoo boxes and one LabGear one. The two which have forced channel scanning on are now dead since the other morning in Northern Ireland (Divis transmitter.)
Daewoo don’t want to know. They advised me to buy a new box, are not offering any sort of discount or even an apology.
I replaced them with Clarity ones from Teco at £14.97, which appear to perform well so far, though I had to buy a RF Modulator for use with an older tv.
Hope this helps anyone reading from Northern Ireland!
Gary.
Oops. Correction! They did offer sincere apologies, but that hardly helps!
Is this just box’s or does it include areals? – all freeview boxes in our house (Bristol area) have gone blank.
I have a Sagem PVR62160T.
This box is still being sold by some shops, and is not just a cheap unit it has a 160gig Hard-drive with twin tuner.
I have also lost BBC channels, not happy.
However I have noticed that is I remove the area after it has scanned the BBC Channels (Mux 1, Channel 41) I get the BBC Channels, but obviously none of the others.
I noticed that SAGEM is not currently listed, however I have seen several people on other fourms with similar problems.
However the error only happens if you re-scan. My box alerted me that new channels have been placed on the network, so I rescaned and lost BBC!!
I heard about this website from Chris Evans Show, keep up the good work.
Chris
I have seen that on the 14/07/08 Sagem are broadcasting a update to for the Sagem PVR62160T, Hopefully that will fix the box.
However they are broadcasting it on MUX 1 (the Channel My PVR has lost!)
Crossing my fingers!
Hi I live in the belfast area (Divis Transmitter) and all 3 of my setpal boxes went dead on Saturday. I wouldnt mind if it was near to the analogue switch off but thats not until 2012. I would like to know what are these new channels that we will get and then I will think about going back to SKY and will leave all my freeview boxes up on Divis mountain.
John
I have just spoken to Sagem today a month after I alerted them to the loss of BBC channels to find out if anything is happening. Surprise! Surprise! Nothing is happening.
The problem appears to be with Freeview, who’s management appear to be both crass and arrogant. I guess the issue is that there is no real sanction, particularly with that toothless Watchdog called OFCOM “monitoring the situation”.
This is particularly disgraceful as we ultimately have no option but to go digital. The thought of lining the pocket of Murdoch or Branson to get digital does not appeal; however, I think the problem lies with the fact that Freeview does not appear to face any direct competition.
Does anyone know if there is an action group for this problem?
My Phillips DTR 1500/05 has just got the dreade flashing red light . Could this be connected? I am in Worcester and signal could be from Sutton coldfield.
If it is only some of your channels like bbc have gone you will probably find them in the 300 or 800 range and it will be sorted sometime.
I’ve lost count of the number of Freeview boxes I’ve bought over the last few years that have all developed faults of one sort or another. The industry should be ashamed of itself. The only one that has consistently worked perfectly, if a little slowly, is my original OnDigital box bought for £200 on the first day of digtal transmissions.
Why, why, why do we need digital television??… Analogue television via terrestrial transmitters is a tried and tested medium and in my opinion should be left well alone. Do we honestley need all these extra digital channels, most of which offer a load of crap as their entertainment fayre. Even the existing BBC channels that used to be a halmark of quality television programming have been dumbed down so much it’s just like “Chewing gum for the eyes” now. What we need is a return to higher broadcasting standards, less downmarket programming and even less low quality digital television broadcasting. The fact that certain digital Freeview boxes have stopped working as a result of transmitter upgrades is, again in my opinion, a blessesd release for the viewers concerned. Maybe these viewers might do something more worthwhile with their televisions instead of watching poor, highly data compressed, blocky digital tv services that have to be the worst looking pictures ever! Sorry to sound so negative, but since the loss of the IBA and quality ITV stations such as Thames and ATV and the mess that the 1990 Broadcasting Act has made of UK broadcasting, is it any wonder that the television industry is the way it is these days. This digital switchover is being forced on the public, an analogue picture will beat a a highly compressed picture any day, so why, if the manufacturers of digital Freeview boxes want to be part of this digital revolution, don’t they at least work out a standard of broadcasting digital tv once and for all and stick with it. I think the reason is that most digital equipment manufacturers want these Freeview boxes and other digital items to last only a short time so that they can have repeat sales when the old box or equipment fails or stops working when broadcasters upgrade the transmission network.
So you’ve never watched, or don’t feel you need, the “quality television programming” of BBC FOUR? And you don’t feel the need for HDTV? Let’s all go back to three channels of ghosting, shadowed, wobbly analogue. In fact, why bother with moving pictures at all? There are some caves with very nice paintings that you could look at…
The Tyne-Tees area is undegoing this upgrade and as of today 15/07/08 the Channel 5 signal for Top-Up TV Anytime is still not available. It’s no use hauraning TUTV they are helpless in the given circumstances, though they have reassured me that , once the transmitter at Pontop Pike is back in service all will be well after a retune
technika aestbs7 lost some of my channels channel 5 has also gone scotland
I can confirm that the recent update to the Tyne Tees transmitter has rendered my Daewoo DS608P freeview decoder to the graveyard!!!
After ringing the Daewoo help no. given on the Freeview website, in the hope of a replacement or discounted freeview box —- forget it!!!They blame the problem on Setpal who went bust years ago.
Why couldn’t anyone warn us not to press ‘yes’ to scan for new and updated channels? It ruined a good saturday night, and now today, after reading frequencycast, I realised what went wrong. Thanks to all those concerned who don’t care and the help I’ll never see. 2012 is time for the great digital TV rip-off. CAN’T WAIT.
This problem is also affecting some TVs, for instance a three year old Sony 37inch Plasma TV, original cost £2800
Border TV Area ( Caldbeck Transmitter ) seems to have gone the same way on the 23rd July .Message ‘NO DIGITAL CHANNELS CAN BE FOUND’ This is unbelievable – I bought my SetPal powered set top from a Radio Times offer because it offered ‘superior reception’ for areas with poor signals . £85.00 .
Also Border TV region , LabGear DTT100 Set Top Box (SetPal)
Wasted many hours scanning on all channel frequencies , swapping cables and re-reading instructions ,trying to get any reception .Nothing .
If I didn’t have access to the internet I would be puzzled and angry .After finding frequencycast.co.uk information , I’m just angry .
What other surprises in store when we face switchover in April next year?
Ofcom – what are you doing about this? Does anyone care?
My Grundig box, bought at the start of the digital service in this area (Lark Stoke off Sutton Coldfield) now gets BBC1 etc in the 800s region, at the end of all the rubbish channel. Better than nothing but very irritating. Who’s fault? The BBC?
I am well pissed off with Daewoo as I had a Daewoo SV900 { cost bnew £ 130 so not a cheap unit } that was impossible to cancel the ‘ Found new Channels ‘ automatic update so I had no choice and of course it went dead .
I complained to Daewoo – they blame everyone except themselves.
When I wrote back pointing out that machines I bought two years before the Daewoo SV900 are still working they ‘ very grudgingly offered a price reduction.
DS700T SET TOP BOX for £19.99 (P&P included)
DSD800M SET TOP BOX for £19.99 (P&P included)
DSD9502TFP + 80GB HDD (TWIN DIGITAL TUNER) for: £67.99 (P&P incl )
DSD9503T + 80GB HDD (TWIN DIGITAL TUNER) for: £71.99(P&P incl )
DRT10 – DVD RECORDER + DIGITAL TUNER for £78 .99 (P&P included)
DSD9520 – STB with 80GB HDD – for £56.99 (P&P included)
calling 0870 100 2525
and quoting ‘Split NIT Affected Customer Offer’
Now personally I will not be taking them up on their offer as after all there is no guarantee their current units will work after the next split.
Units I bought ‘ two years ‘ before the Daewoo are still working so really it was just pure ‘ penny pinching ‘
It will take a lot more than a tenner discount to get my Custom Back.
I own nine units and the best one by a mile is the Wharfedale LPDV832B { £ 25 } so take a tip from me buy that instead.
Confirmation about the DAEWOO DS608P – it stopped on the 31/07 – No signal found etc.. I checked all the installation and it is fine.. I will buy another box.. but not a DAEWOO
Well, failing Freeview boxes this is the price the consumer is now paying for deregulated broadcasting unfortunately… I am in favour of increased channel choice both on TV and radio, but without a well thought out technical standard to begin with what chance has digital broadcasting got?? When we had both the BBC and the IBA regulating the technical broadcasting standards, then this Freeview set-top box fiasco wouldn’t have happened in the first place. Even with BBC’s Teletext and IBA’s Oracle text services the industry shared the same technical standards, so that all the TV text decoders would work properly. With the toothless OFCOM regulating the broadcasting standards in the UK, then what do you expect? These transmitter upgrades to the digital network should have been planned for years ago so that equipment should be future proofed to allow for such expansion. Even as I write they are using two different methods of digital transmission, QAM 16 on BBC channels and the much more inferior QAM 64 digital transmission coding on the commercial channels. Why can’t the broadcasters do as they did in the olden days of broadcasting and agree on one technical standard for a particular system, I.E: PAL I for colour television on analogue, and not keep upgrading a system like they are now doing with digital television and making the hardware that the viewing public have paid for totally useless. I have nothing against digital TV, but surely the broadcasting industry could try and strive for a quality system, that uses much less digital compression, which would give a better picture quality, with less blocky looking pictures, rather than the multi channels squeezed into a single 8MHz channel spacing on UHF. HDTV really should also standardise it’s line standard, is it going to be, 720 interlaced, 720 progressive, or 1080 progressive as the final line standrad for HDTV? I would rather we had a mere 3 or 4 real quality channels broadcasting in digital quality, (Remember the rather good BSB D-MAC broadcasts from the Marco Polo satellite?) rather than 700 or more in lower picture quality on the current digital platforms. As an engineeer myself, I get to see a lot of people with failed digital freeeview boxes, even without the latest transmitter upgrades these boxes pose a great problem with reception of signals, especially here in a fringe reception area, Southend-on-sea, in the East of England. Our regional transmitter at Sudbury has such a low digital output on some channels until the 2011 switchover, that not all channels are receivable even with an aerial upgraded to group W or group E. I am begining to think that the best way to watch television in the future is by using a PC and watching online via broadband.
I have had this happen today with my portland unit – moved tv had to re scan now got nothing. Sooooooooooo peeed of as rely on the kids channels to get jobs done. REally cant afford new unit – will be calling manafacture tomorrow but doubt will get any joy.
Grundig box lost some of its EPG (Mux2) I rescanned and now BBC is up in the 800’s but the EPG is back.
My Toshiba TV has lost EPG – I might risk a rescan…
London – Crystal Palace – so I suspect quite a few grumpy TV viewers out there.
WHY WASNT THIS PUBLICISED ANYWHERE???
Can someone advise on a replacement box? Had a Daewoo DS608P and it stopped finding any channels at all during the week. Signal is from Crytal Palace. Went out and bought a new box Sagem ITD59NG – same problem (aaargh), bought new connecting co-ax cables, changed Scart cable etc still no channels. Could the Sagem have the same problem or should I start tearing down all the Co-ax cable to my aerial (miles above on the roof)??
I’m joining the klub. My BT Setpal stopped picking up signals from Blackhill, for probably the same reasons above. I contacted BT, but no response,…
To Caroline – take back the Sagem ITD59NG and demand a full refund.
Go to Argos and buy a Wharfedale LPDV832B { £ 25 } – that can cope with the latest change.
————————-
I don’t think some people { who are not affected by the recent change } fully appreciate that the only reason why we have units sitting in the corner ‘ dead as a dodo ‘ is because there was no switch that could have been selected to stop the box making a rescan.
Yes I know the vast majority of box’s have selective default settings at least in my case I had two separate units both impossible to prevent them committing hari kari.
Once they lock up – they lock up and therefor will not see any OTA update so really any Company that claims there is one in the pipeline is talking a load of Bollocks.
All this should have been sorted out Months ago but the Companies have made a Corporate decision not to make a update available well before the split.
Lets look at it in Money terms – most of them could have sorted the problem out well in advance but they realised they could ‘ wash their hands of the whole affair ‘ so generating extra Sales although only a fool would buy more products from the same Companies that have a built in Self-destruct mechanism.
So far Daewoo Blame Freeview – Sagem point out they are not on the list but that is no comfort to me as its Buggered.
Make no mistake about this – this is only the first wave.
We need a standard – like the ‘ HDTV READY ‘ or ‘ Full HDTV ‘ so that Consumers would know what they are buying.
So far all they have been doing is passing the buck – there is no point trying to shut the stable door after the horse has bolted.
I was aware the split was going to be made { unlike many Consumers } but as it was not possible to prevent the units making a rescan
‘ Both hands were tied behind my back ‘ and I was not the only one
Daewoo have no right to blame Freeview. Split nits were always in the DVB-T spec and Daewoo and the other manufacturers are clearly at fault for not making the boxes to the spec, i.e. fit for the purpose. All these manufacturers should be forced to give refunds under the sale of goods act.
I have a Grundig GTD1500 v3.6 which is putting BBC channels in the 800’s. Someone I know of has one v5.3 which is OK. Have I missed an update or are there different versions out there?
Also have a Panasonic TU-CT30 which is putting BBC channels on empty channels above 104. No one else has mentioned Panasonic, is mine unique?
From Daewoo —- I write with reference to your e-mail below regarding the loss of signal to your Daewoo VCR/Digital Receiver SV900. I can confirm that when this product was manufactured it was designed to meet all the criteria for it to receive
the digital signal, and operate as it should do. Therefore, we had no prior knowledge that these products would not be compatible with future digital signals. Please review the statement that has been released by Freeview in relation to this “signal shutdown”:
a later e-mail stated – I am sorry for not apologising for this situation, ‘ but if the DMOL had not cut the signal then the box would still operate ‘ , so we have not caused this situation
Now if I was a normal Consumer who did not understand Electronics – { in fact I am retired University Lecturer in Advance Computer Design } I would get the impression that Daewoo was Blameless when in fact I know they did not build their unit to be compatible with other units sold around the same period.
The Daewoo VCR/Digital Receiver SV900 was not a Cheap box – it cost £ 140 which was more expensive than a Video and stb but at the time I needed space hence a combined box made sense although once I got it out the box I worked out the designer was a FOOL – for example press stop and hold it down for a nano second longer then the tape would eject as the idiot had combined the stop and eject button { with hair trigger sensitivity } – even worse it was crammed right above the play button so close together that 50 % of the time I would press play and accidentally eject the tape at the same time.
every week it would attempt to download adverts from ‘ setpal ‘ although they had gone bust so while all that was going on it would stop recording.
it was a Rubbish Unit and I would never buy from Daewoo again.
Having caught a one minute broadcast on the local TV news, we at least had some idea why our Daewoo box was no longer working. What a pity we were not informed before hand so at least we were not disappointed when we sat down to watch TV only to find that we need to buy another one. We work full time and have to wait til the weekend to shop – let alone the cost and time.
Who exactly is responsible for NOT telling us!!
Emma
Devon
Caught in the final tranch of this like everyone else on here. Found this statement:
http://www.freeview.co.uk/help/faq/id104963
It says “The number of affected boxes represents around 1% of all Freeview equipment sold to date, although the number of people who’ve contacted Freeview and the manufacturers so far suggests the actual number could be much lower.”
And digital is the future, “they” tell us.
In reply to ‘ Emma Hines ‘
When you bought Your New Box did you ask how long that will remain working for as the next so called ‘ Improvements ‘ is due next Year so unless the store has a crystal Ball there is no way they can Predict which units will survive the next round of Improvements.
The STB builders know what is next in the pipe line and they know which units is next for the Chop.
Just you wait and see when the next ‘ Improvements ‘ kick in Freeview will be Claiming its still only 1 % – there is something like 3,500,000 setpal units that were in use in the UK but as far as I am aware they are all useless so really the figures don’t add up.
Its all spin spin and more spin.
Well, well … the suppliers of IT equipment won’t keep us informed, via their devices, of impending faults. And neither will our government. Lies, distortions, spin, profits by any means, and politics corrupted by money are legacies we suffer from Thatcher and Blair. Don’t buy from crap companies and don’t vote for crap governments.
Its Clearly a Conspiracy.
Think about .
How many Adverts for STB Units Highlight how future proof their unit’s are ?
Now I owned a Original OnDIGITAL Box { bought just before they went on air }
I did not expect it to last as long as it did but it was a right kick in the teeth for box’s half its age not being able to cope with the so called Improvements.
Remmeber some of the dead box’s were still on sale this year – they are the lucky ones but if you bought it over a year ago its a major hassle to get a refund.
Thank you forgiving out some sensible information about what is going on with Freeview.
I am angry about the lack of publicity and consultation about this change which affects so many people. I came across this problem by chance when browsing the Freeview website. I i e-mailed (12.7.08) and asked when it was going to affect London. I received a reply (18.7.08) which did not answer my question and simply repeated what was on the website and the went on:
”From the information we have, it is likely that your box will be affected by future enhancements. Please look out for further information in local press.”
Subsequently the date for the London change has been put on the website. It happened on 29.7.08 which must have been known when Mr Burns replied to me. I replied asking for an address to complain to and he kindly provided the following:
”Please find below details regarding making a complaint. If you could put your complaint in writing to Ms Newey, she will raise it at the relevant industry committee;
Ms Heather Newey
Freeview
Broadcast Centre (BC3 B6)
201 Wood Lane
London
W12 7TP”
It would be great if others would write too.
My Labgear box (Setpal) is still working but I think only because I have not switched it off or accepted new channels.
I am now trying to find a replacement with the same functionality but it is proving difficult. Does anyone reading this blog know of a freeview receiver or PVR which has any of the following features?
1. Signal boosting for use in weak signal areas
2. A button which allows you to swap between two channels
3. Volume control
I would be grateful for any advice
I live in Tiptree, Essex and looks like my SetPal Unit died today as a result of the recent transmitter upgrade in my area (We feed off the Sudbury transmiter). My wife switched the unit off to access TeleTex and when the Unit was switched back on I could not tune the Unit in to receive the channels.
It really does annoy me that no warnings were given of these upgrades, the timetable and the Units that would possibly be affected. I was completey puzzled why my Unit suddenly failed and only found out the info from this website.
Oh well looks like i will be going to Chelmsford tomorrow to purchase another Unit. I’m looking to purchase the Philips DTR220. I’m hoping this Unit is compatible with the Transmitter upgrade. Once its setup i will turn it off and see what happens. If it fails, I shall return it to the Retailer.
Anyone who owns a SetPal Unit and there is 3,500,000 users in the British Isle’s
They cant switch the unit on standby or switch it off
If you get a request ‘ New Channels in the Flow ‘ Don’t be a fool and accept it .
Some units will allow you to Cancel.
If you accept it – you have set a ticking Bomb and it will go DEAD.
Put it this way far better having 99.9 % of Something than 100 % of NOTHING
A message to Alan White – when you buy the Philips DTR220 ask them what Guarantees they offer as to if that unit will be able to cope with ‘ the next changes due in a few Years ‘ and see what they say.
No doubt the majority of the 3.5 million Setpal users and the vast majority of Freeview Users, are like me, not aware of the Transmitter upgrade and as such it would have been really helpful if some form of advertising campaign had been run by Freeview/Ofcom/TV Companys, to warn users of these boxes what will happen if they turn off their boxes/accept a channel update.
Someone should now take ownership of this issue and launch a “damage limitation” exercise.
As for asking shop staff the question posed in Brian Carson’s reply, I bet 99.9% of the staff won’t have a clue what one is asking.
Yes I agree with Alan White as Customers were left high and dry and no one had the Balls to stand up and say ‘ The Buck stops Here ‘
My two units were three and four year old – not exactly Ancient and the really annoying part is that units bought years before have still been able to cope so clearly someone is not telling the whole Truth.
Its really the same situation with DAB and DAB+ – for years they have been flogging DAB Units and most of which don’t stand a hope in hells Change of ever being upgraded to DAB+
Yes I will admit that ‘ PURE ‘ have been doing their best but walk into any High street chain and ask for a DAB+ set and they will look at you if you were from Mars.
There are millions of people in the UK that have a DAB radio so Ofcom will have to weigh up the advantages of phasing in a DAB+ system with the disadvantage of phasing out the current digital system.
It’s also likely that if DAB+ were to be adopted in the UK, there would be a period when both DAB and DAB+ would run alongside one another
But once it goes that’s another load of units being sent to the scrap heap.
I don’t like being treated as a MUG and I will not buy units that I know have only a limited time scale
my Bush 28″ widescreen IDTV set has done this
so have brought external freeview box
By the way I read on another Forum that a Sony IDTV has also packed up due to the same problem so really Freeview is kidding them self that its only 1% of the market.
They dont have a clue how many of the Cheaper Buffers were used – all they did was Guess.
Really its not Good enough.
With no advance warning Consumers were taking a ‘ Blind gamble ‘ as after all with no advance information how can Consumers make a educated Choice.
By the way the words at
http://www.freeview.co.uk/help/faq/id104963
has remained unchanged so I would advise as many people as possible to send a e-mail to info@freeview.co.uk and tell them to get their Head out of the Sand as its very annoying they claim that very few people have been affected.
the two key question to ask them is
How can a Consumer know in advance which units would stop working after the latest so called improvements. ?
When they may make further improvements what Guarantee that any box sold today will not end up in the scrap heap ?
To put it simply..Daewoo have handled this appallingly..Their attitude stinks and quite simply IT WILL NEVER ENTER INTO MY HEAD TO BUY A DAEWOO PRODUCT AGAIN!
A notice supplied with a Panasonic TU-CT20 Digital box states:-
We are pleased to advise you that this model is capable of detecting new services as they become available, and informing you of their existence via an on screen message.
At the time of manufacture, this feature was not supported by the broadcasters, therefore, the default setting for “New Service
Message” is OFF.
To switch this feature on, when it becomes available from
broadcasters, this is then followed by relevant instructions.
So.the broadcasters have known about it all along – this box, I
think, is about 4 years old and is still working.
If you haven’t done so already, please take a look at todays Daily Express. It features an article on this issue in which my comments have been included…… Fame at last !!
It appears that Freeview are still not budging from their stance of providing no compensation.
Hi
To be honest I’ve given up with Freeview.
I had a state of the art aerial installed, it works quite well in the conservatory but as soon as you spit on it I would half the channels in the front room. CBeebies was a godsend. Just as somebody else has written, it allowed me to get some housework done.
I’ve had an old battered Phillips OnDigital Box since 2002 and it’s served me well but enough was enough.
I already had Virgin B/band & phone & I’ve added a TV package to it via their retention team. By doing this I also upgraded to a free calls pack 24/7 except to 0870 & mobile.
The kids are happy, the wife is happy, I’m relieved! It absolutely chucked it down last week and I know I would have lost loads of channels & my patience but everything worked as you’d want it to.
The picture is great – I can even email my telly when I’m in work.
I’d never go back now – I still have the other Freeview box in the conservatory that one is a SAGEM so I will say no to the upgrade.
I agree with the sentiments that it’s all a great big con. The government has already spent the money from the Terrestrial signal sell off – even though it’s not happened yet.
As for LCD & Plasma – they’re just a great big rip as well. Flimsy, dodgy picture – I’m not that convinced!
I’ve loved my Freeview for years – no more.
Regards
Lost signal from my Bush freeview box. The menu proclaimed that there was no signal coming in. After hours spent dismembering all my wiring I finally gave up. Thanks freeview for any information saying that my box was now inoperable. A truly miserable service, and yet another expense. Are they (Bush/Freeview)allowed to get away with what amounts to taking money under false pretences.
Just by chance I spoke to an aerial installer today re. our poor TV signal. Asking about the Freeview problem we have been having this past 3 weeks – he says that he had just had a note round about it. We have a Daewoo Setpal which is now completely useless and the sony freeview has very limited channels now. I was completely in the dark about it until today thinking that the boxes/aerial had gone wrong. Hence me looking at the internet this afternoon.
What freeview box is best to buy do you think now?
Wrote to BBC WATCHDOG today,a bit of bad publicity would help.
Both Daewoo&Freeview need to compensate owners of boxes.